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Right to Life . . . a top-to-bottom consideration


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Remember those ants, the stars of my ‘Weird thoughts’ topic, last week, when I ‘needed' to wipe-out a hundred or two, for daring to trespass into my office?

Whether or not, much has happened since then to impact upon my thoughts on the entire issue of right to life, be it the life of an ant, a rat, an elephant . . . or a human-being.

As usual, I’ve spent a good amount of time thinking – thinking all sorts of things, just like everyone else – but last week’s ant slaughter incident has made me take a more down-to-earth look at a person's or any creature’s right to life.

Far be it from me to bore you with my thoughts on the issue of taking or preserving the life of another ‘thing’, I’d be happy as Larry if a member or two gave me their views as to whether it’s right to blat an ant or to swat a fly or to shoot an elephant or, on the darker side, to torture a man or woman to death.

Whilst anyone interested may enjoy reflecting on their take on the R-t-L issue, here’s a more than in-depth guide to the European Court of Human Rights approach to the issue.

https://www.echr.coe.int/Documents/Guide_Art_2_ENG.pdf

Whilst clearly only addressing human life rights, it may just act as a welcome, or maybe unwelcome, catalyst for considering applying similar ethics and logic towards the vastly perplexing insect and animal kingdoms.

Food for thought, maybe, other than the probable one that KC’s having a melt-down?

 

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I try not to kill anything

 

I will kill mosquitos but flies, things that actually don't interfere with you, I let them be.

I live in a downtown condo, if I have a big moth in my apartment, I just let it be, it isn't harming me

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22 minutes ago, King Cotton said:

Remember those ants, the stars of my ‘Weird thoughts’ topic, last week, when I ‘needed' to wipe-out a hundred or two, for daring to trespass into my office?

Whether or not, much has happened since then to impact upon my thoughts on the entire issue of right to life, be it the life of an ant, a rat, an elephant . . . or a human-being.

As usual, I’ve spent a good amount of time thinking – thinking all sorts of things, just like everyone else – but last week’s ant slaughter incident has made me take a more down-to-earth look at a person's or any creature’s right to life.

Far be it from me to bore you with my thoughts on the issue of taking or preserving the life of another ‘thing’, I’d be happy as Larry if a member or two gave me their views as to whether it’s right to blat an ant or to swat a fly or to shoot an elephant or, on the darker side, to torture a man or woman to death.

Whilst anyone interested may enjoy reflecting on their take on the R-t-L issue, here’s a more than in-depth guide to the European Court of Human Rights approach to the issue.

https://www.echr.coe.int/Documents/Guide_Art_2_ENG.pdf

Whilst clearly only addressing human life rights, it may just act as a welcome, or maybe unwelcome, catalyst for considering applying similar ethics and logic towards the vastly perplexing insect and animal kingdoms.

Food for thought, maybe, other than the probable one that KC’s having a melt-down?

According to sub-section B.2, subsection 2 of the European Court of Rights charter that you have kindly provided a link to, I have every right to stamp on any cockroach which appears in my kitchen. As for the ants on your balcony table, you may be in breach, unless you can submit the scientific analysis on your weird thoughts thread.

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9 minutes ago, Marc26 said:

I try not to kill anything

I will kill mosquitos but flies, things that actually don't interfere with you, I let them be.

I live in a downtown condo, if I have a big moth in my apartment, I just let it be, it isn't harming me

I’m not a killer either. Cockroaches are fair game, as are mosquitoes. Fish when I catch them. Green ants, only to eat them occasionally. That’s about it.

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11 minutes ago, Marc26 said:

I try not to kill anything

I will kill mosquitos but flies, things that actually don't interfere with you, I let them be.

I live in a downtown condo, if I have a big moth in my apartment, I just let it be, it isn't harming me

Wow, that was a speedy response @Marc26and so heart-warming too, especially given my kinder feelings towards anything that our creator has blessed with a fully-working and task-committed purpose to life, be it taking a speck of sugar, back downstairs and under the timber pile to where the ants have their colonial home or the wasp, busily building its nest on the window frame. Whatever form these entities present, I'm now a much nicer guy towards them.

And thanks for your similar-toned post, too. That was so good!

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4 minutes ago, King Cotton said:

Wow, that was a speedy response @Marc26and so heart-warming too, especially given my kinder feelings towards anything that our creator has blessed with a fully-working and task-committed purpose to life, be it taking a speck of sugar, back downstairs and under the timber pile to where the ants have their colonial home or the wasp, busily building its nest on the window frame. Whatever form these entities present, I'm now a much nicer guy towards them.

And thanks for your similar-toned post, too. That was so good!

Ha, thanks

We were recently in Mexico and there were a lot of Iquanas at the resorts we stayed in.

At the restaurant, one of the waiters kicked an iquana off the balcony(not hard but still not nice) and I got upset.

My wife was making fun of me(she has a black heart)

And I said "iquanas have feelings too"

She choked on her drink  laughing at me(but I was serious)

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11 minutes ago, BigHewer said:

According to sub-section B.2, subsection 2 of the European Court of Rights charter that you have kindly provided a link to, I have every right to stamp on any cockroach which appears in my kitchen. As for the ants on your balcony table, you may be in breach, unless you can submit the scientific analysis further up the thread.

Now then, @BigHewer . . . what about those poor cockroaches, most if not all of whom will have that precious - to them! - task-commitment towards doing their bit to preserve their kith and kin, down there under your place? How about you giving them a gentle prod towards the door, instead of giving them the 'no-more'?     Just asking (:-)

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1 minute ago, Marc26 said:

Ha, thanks

We were recently in Mexico and there were a lot of Iquanas at the resorts we stayed in.

At the restaurant, one of the waiters kicked an iquana off the balcony(not hard but still not nice) and I got upset.

My wife was making fun of me(she has a black heart)

And I said "iquanas have feelings too"

She choked on her drink  laughing at me(but I was serious)

Terrific!!

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6 minutes ago, King Cotton said:

Now then, @BigHewer . . . what about those poor cockroaches, most if not all of whom will have that precious - to them! - task-commitment towards doing their bit to preserve their kith and kin, down there under your place? How about you giving them a gentle prod towards the door, instead of giving them the 'no-more'?     Just asking (:-)

Ah.. you are referring to the status I currently apply to spiders, for whom banishment applies rather than the mandatory death penalty.

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15 minutes ago, Marc26 said:

Ha, thanks

We were recently in Mexico and there were a lot of Iquanas at the resorts we stayed in.

At the restaurant, one of the waiters kicked an iquana off the balcony(not hard but still not nice) and I got upset.

My wife was making fun of me(she has a black heart)

And I said "iquanas have feelings too"

She choked on her drink  laughing at me(but I was serious)

ILM joins BLM

Edited by JohninDubin
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Today I killed probably hundreds of red ants in cooked rice left out in my kitchen. They showed me where they were staying and blamo. No ants or cockroaches in my kitchen or house or they get out of control. Flies are bye bye the same as moths.  Different ants can be quite hard as they all have different tactics.

I don’t kill the little lizards and usually knock them to the ground, catch them and toss outside by hand. Each week probably near 5 or so that get into the home. But they are pests and crap everywhere so no cannot have a free pass time stay. But they can live.

Today as usual I went running, and I jumped over all bugs especially one called the red bug which is common, and a hairy caterpillar just to name a few. Just don’t  pick the hairy caterpillars up by hand if you know what I mean. But Except cockroaches which I don’t normally ever there, but I will step on them. I’m not Hindu.

So just today alone I jumped over several normal bugs and while back at home swept scooted what resembles to be a nice sized wolf spider out the front door. If they are in the wrong place in the house then they might have to go unless I can get them out ok. 
Centipedes die, millipedes or similar live. 
Hisnt snails get hard tossed over the fence. Dint care if live or die as they eat my plants and nice flowers. Snakes I let live if not dangerous. Mosquitos die. Ants outside getting under my house or into cracks die. The other ants will live. 
It is a sally thing for me, and so I make decisions based on some morality and others of intrusion and danger. 

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I would prefer not to kill anything, but those ants.....well, they were sent to God.

My wife said to me a long time ago, if they (any life) is not harming us, then we all live together.

I was a vegetarian for some time a while, long time ago. But I missed bacon sandwiches.

We have a pond, I think of the fish as pets.

We could talk about our parents, & how, when the end was near, the decisions we had to make, about their 'right to life'

I could, but it would be difficult.

 

Too serious. I'll think of something else.

 

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8 hours ago, HolyCowCm said:

So just today alone I jumped over several normal bugs and while back at home swept scooted what resembles to be a nice sized wolf spider out the front door. If they are in the wrong place in the house then they might have to go unless I can get them out ok. 
Centipedes die, millipedes or similar live. 
Hisnt snails get hard tossed over the fence. Dint care if live or die as they eat my plants and nice flowers. Snakes I let live if not dangerous. Mosquitos die. Ants outside getting under my house or into cracks die. The other ants will live. 
It is a sally thing for me, and so I make decisions based on some morality and others of intrusion and danger. 

Love it. This reads like an excerpt from the start-up guidelines on animal treatment in some far off tropical commune. But it seems we are on exactly the same page.

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1 hour ago, Faraday said:

I would prefer not to kill anything, but those ants.....well, they were sent to God.

My wife said to me a long time ago, if they (any life) is not harming us, then we all live together.

On the other side of the coin, I found my wife to be a bit too willing an executioner in the early days. Mandatory death penalty for most small critters found in the house.

Over the years, she’s gradually become more merciful, to the relief of generations of spiders, grasshoppers and beetles in our neighborhood.

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31 minutes ago, BigHewer said:

Love it. This reads like an excerpt from the start-up guidelines on animal treatment in some far off tropical commune. But it seems we are on exactly the same page.

Yeah life in a tropical climate. Even CM. Except for the spelling errors as I now see, it is basically how I see things and have to do them in order to maintain my home. I did forget to mention, rats are bye bye unless they are outside in a really really safe zone which is basically outside my property lines, otherwise nesting even outside they will be goners. Give and take in this world but unnecessarily killing or squashing something is no for me. Lately we have had the Thai horned fighting beetle showing up. Just saved one up side down in the street and showed the kids and then set it free, and there were 2 others we had over the last several to 6 weeks we have had come that I saved from my dogs. Lovely wonderful adorable creatures. Cruel to keep them as pets or fight them as I see it. they do love their sugar cane though.

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8 hours ago, Marc26 said:
8 hours ago, JohninDubin said:

ILM joins BLM

I should make t-shirts!

As long as it wasn't a snakeskin T-shirt.

Talking of which:
We have a young cat that our son brought home a couple of months earlier. Two days ago in the afternoon I was laying on the bed having a nap, the cat was asleep on my lap.
Suddenly there was a thump and some kerfuffle (a disturbance) and I noticed the cat had disappeared from my lap, Initially I thought it had turned over and dropped off the bed.

Then I saw the cat going after something near the glass sliding doors into the garden. We have one of the doors open during the day to let the air circulate. The mesh mozzie screen door has almost a half-inch gap where it's in front of, but overlapping the other door.

At first I thought the cat had a gecko in her mouth and was shaking it about. Then I realised it was a snake.
I am petrified of snakes, it's a phobia. Seeing a snake I have always run away - seriously. My wife's the same.
If we see one near the house, my wife will call the motorbike repair shop opposite and the guy comes across to deal with it. He just prods it and even picks it up, to throw it away somewhere else.

I digress. For the first time in my life instinct took over. We had a snake inside our bedroom and it was also wrapping itself around the cat's head and front legs.I picked the cat up by the rear legs and was shaking it to get the cat to open her mouth and let go of the snake. Eventually she did and the snake dropped onto the tiled floor. I threw the cat out the bedroom door into the main room and shut the door.

Now I could concentrate on the angry snake in the corner. I grabbed a can of mozzie spray and sprayed the snake, chasing it in the corner of the bedroom. Unsurprisingly the snake was still very much alive. It went under a door into our walk-in wardrobe room.
It was still instinct now that I was chasing a snake I was petrified of. I ended up stabbing at the snake with the metal spray can. Third attempt I got it's head caught under the can, between the base of the can and the tiled floor.

It felt like days to me that I was there squashing the snake to death, it was probably five minutes.
When I was sure it was dead I scooped it into a dustpan and threw it the corner of the garden. it was ten or twelve inches long.

It took me a while to get over it, having to deal with a snake for the first time in my life. I don't think the snake will get over it.

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17 minutes ago, HolyCowCm said:

I did forget to mention, rats are bye bye unless they are outside in a really really safe zone which is basically outside my property lines, otherwise nesting even outside they will be goners. Give and take in this world but unnecessarily killing or squashing something is no for me.

I’ve luckily never been faced with this particular moral dilemma. Where I live we have to contribute a nominal fee annually to the residents’ association for the upkeep of a colony of stray cats which patrol the area. It must work well because I’ve never seen a rodent in the neighborhood. When I visit friends in other areas, I see them.

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1 hour ago, BigHewer said:

I’ve luckily never been faced with this particular moral dilemma. Where I live we have to contribute a nominal fee annually to the residents’ association for the upkeep of a colony of stray cats which patrol the area. It must work well because I’ve never seen a rodent in the neighborhood. When I visit friends in other areas, I see them.

Ah-ha, @BigHewer . . . your mention of residents' association gives more than a lie to your present location, which I have more than a hunch isn't in this country. What an excellent approach towards taking the 'live or die' decision out of residents' hands and letting it rest, presumably heavily, on the conscience of those poor but industrial cats . . . passing the buck, eh . . . or the tabby, at least!

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1 hour ago, Bluesofa said:

I am petrified of snakes, it's a phobia. Seeing a snake I have always run away - seriously. My wife's the same.

I do understand your phobia and am not making light of it, but once you are able to identify the snakes near where you live, your fear might be better controlled if you know they aren't likely hazardous to you, or your cat.

I was much like you, terrified of almost all slithering things.  When I was a child, I accidentally stepped in a swirling ball of garter snakes and it imprinted a strong fear of the reptiles.

Later, as a youth, my family moved to an area that had four types of commonly found poisonous snakes.  We all learned to identify them, even from a distance and avoided any truly dangerous encounters.

I've learned about the snakes I'm most likely to meet where I live now, and pythons, when seen don't make me run and hide...just the cobras.

Like I said, I'm not making light, but knowing what's out there makes it easier to avoid a heart attack when you do see one.  I still don't like them, but I don't freak out when I see one, now.

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1 hour ago, Bluesofa said:

As long as it wasn't a snakeskin T-shirt.

Talking of which:
We have a young cat that our son brought home a couple of months earlier. Two days ago in the afternoon I was laying on the bed having a nap, the cat was asleep on my lap.
Suddenly there was a thump and some kerfuffle (a disturbance) and I noticed the cat had disappeared from my lap, Initially I thought it had turned over and dropped off the bed.

Then I saw the cat going after something near the glass sliding doors into the garden. We have one of the doors open during the day to let the air circulate. The mesh mozzie screen door has almost a half-inch gap where it's in front of, but overlapping the other door.

At first I thought the cat had a gecko in her mouth and was shaking it about. Then I realised it was a snake.
I am petrified of snakes, it's a phobia. Seeing a snake I have always run away - seriously. My wife's the same.
If we see one near the house, my wife will call the motorbike repair shop opposite and the guy comes across to deal with it. He just prods it and even picks it up, to throw it away somewhere else.

I digress. For the first time in my life instinct took over. We had a snake inside our bedroom and it was also wrapping itself around the cat's head and front legs.I picked the cat up by the rear legs and was shaking it to get the cat to open her mouth and let go of the snake. Eventually she did and the snake dropped onto the tiled floor. I threw the cat out the bedroom door into the main room and shut the door.

Now I could concentrate on the angry snake in the corner. I grabbed a can of mozzie spray and sprayed the snake, chasing it in the corner of the bedroom. Unsurprisingly the snake was still very much alive. It went under a door into our walk-in wardrobe room.
It was still instinct now that I was chasing a snake I was petrified of. I ended up stabbing at the snake with the metal spray can. Third attempt I got it's head caught under the can, between the base of the can and the tiled floor.

It felt like days to me that I was there squashing the snake to death, it was probably five minutes.
When I was sure it was dead I scooped it into a dustpan and threw it the corner of the garden. it was ten or twelve inches long.

It took me a while to get over it, having to deal with a snake for the first time in my life. I don't think the snake will get over it.

I'm absolutely petrified of snakes, even your story freaks me out

 

And that's a major concern of mine when/if we ever move to Thailand 

I'm also worried about any dogs I will have and snakes if we let them out in the yard

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The right to life ... that's complicated .

Ants are produced by their queen , who , in turn , gets fed by the ' working ants ' . You kill a few , they will be replaced soon . If you want to get rid of all of them , you will need to locate the queen .

Same with termites .

What was really wonderful with our planet , is that ecosystems tend to regulate and ' balance ' itself . If there are too many of a species that is damaging the balance of the system , the system ( if still in good condition ) , will find a way to regulate the overpopulation and stay functional .

The same is happening now with the homo sapiens .

 

This post is ' hidden ' now and needs to be reviewed by a mod first ...

What happens ? Something illegal here ?

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