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Russia v Ukraine - How This Is Going To End


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3 minutes ago, Fanta said:

Not at all. The following part of your rant made me laugh out loud. 

If more people thought like you there would be less people. 

Well 7.7 billion humans is certainly too many.jumped 5.7 billion in 80 years ? 

clearly neither desirable not sustainable.

Modern medicine / food enabling very low quality / high cost ( social & economic) “existence” for ridiculous extended periods now. 

Although some countries like Russia, Japan, Italy have drastically stopped breeding so populations rapidly declining even with all these zombie coffin- dodgers hanging on endlessly at our expense. 

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Russian missile strike on residential area near Odesa. 18 dead including 2 kids. 

https://www.foxnews.com/world/russian-missile-strike-odesa-kills-18-ukrainians-2-children-government

Come on, all you Putin-curious Russia enthusiasts. Justify that please. Was there an arms depot nearby? Perhaps an accordion factory disguised as something else? I look forward to your various BS excuses why this was unfortunate but okay. Get real. 

Come on, we’re all waiting for your creative, entertaining explanation.

 

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7 minutes ago, BigHewer said:


Russian missile strike on residential area near Odesa. 18 dead including 2 kids. 

https://www.foxnews.com/world/russian-missile-strike-odesa-kills-18-ukrainians-2-children-government

Come on, all you Putin-curious Russia enthusiasts. Justify that please. Was there an arms depot nearby? Perhaps an accordion factory disguised as something else? I look forward to your various BS excuses why this was unfortunate but okay. Get real. 

Come on, we’re all waiting for your creative, entertaining explanation.

No doubt the apartment block was being used to house military personnel, with an underground repair facility for damaged armoured vehicles. The civilians were being used as shields. 🙄

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3 minutes ago, Faz said:

No doubt the apartment block was being used to house military personnel, with an underground repair facility for damaged armoured vehicles. The civilians were being used as shields. 🙄

Somewhere in Russia. A member of the hierarchy is nodding intently and saying “this chap Faz has potential”. 😉

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8 hours ago, EdwardV said:

From this article it appears half of the Russian missiles being fired are some 50 year old. Not all that accurate to begin with, even less in old age. Interestingly both the Ukrainian general and the UK military don’t really think Russia is actually aiming at civilian targets. Just the combination of old inaccurate weapons, extremely large warheads, and not really caring is having brutal results for Ukrainian citizens. 
 

https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2022/6/30/russia-ramping-up-missile-strikes-ukrainian-general-says

Nah, this cannot be.

Surely the murderous, baby-eating Russian thugs are deliberately directing their missiles and know exactly where they will strike.

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11 minutes ago, astro said:

Nah, this cannot be.

Surely the murderous, baby-eating Russian thugs are deliberately directing their missiles and know exactly where they will strike.

According to Czar Putin they dont target civilians and their missiles never miss.

So evidently what they hit was a hotbed of nazis kids and pregnant women. 

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3 hours ago, oldschooler said:

You must be specific with links when making exaggerated / false claims on serious matters. 😠

He's having a bad day 😀

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5 minutes ago, astro said:

Russian thugs are deliberately directing their missiles and know exactly where they will strike.

The real problem seems to be Russia doesn't really know where the missiles will strike. Yet that doesn't seem to stop them from using them anyway. Think about that for a minute. Just how callous, or uncaring about possible civilian casualties do you have to be to launch a old inaccurate missile with a 12K pound warhead into the center of a populated city? This while knowing there is a very good chance it won't even hit it's intended target. 

Of course there is a reason Russia is turning to these missiles in increasing numbers: 

For the first time, Russia has admitted that it is running out of weapons in the Ukraine war, after President Vladimir Putin's government created a draft federal law that would allow the country to quickly repair weapons and military equipment. On Thursday evening, the Kremlin submitted a bill to the State Duma on "special economic measures" for "counterterrorist and other operations" outside of Russia. An explanatory note attached to the bill said that there is, particularly amid Putin's war against Ukraine, "a short-term increased need for the repair of weapons and military equipment." The bill proposed, among other measures, "the implementation of material assets from state reserves" and "the temporary activation of mobilization capacities and facilities," as well as overtime work in "individual organizations."

Russia Admits It's Running Out of Weapons in Ukraine War (msn.com)

Basically the Russia economy is going to a war footing. The bill will allow the central government to control private business to further the war effort. Good for the war, bad for the economy in general. Especially an economy struggling as it enters recession from being something much worse. That's how bad the war is going against little tiny and weak Ukraine.  

 

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12 hours ago, EdwardV said:

Your link does’t say what you claimed. Want to back it up or shall we just assume you made up those figures? 

120x200=24,000 dead. I think you will not argue that official Kyiv, to put it mildly, downplays its losses. That is, we can say that the figure of 50,000 that Russia is talking about is quite realistic.

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12 hours ago, Marble-eye said:

IMO your post is not in the best possible taste, that is to say if you mean murderous Russian soldiers/thugs killing Ukrainians makes their leaders "stupid" it might be time for you to rethink the Russian perspective. 

The article is about combatants.  

yes, such losses speak of the incompetence of the Ukrainian military commanders.  

slightly larger than Russian ones.

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11 hours ago, EdwardV said:

Here we go again: 

A Russian missile struck a multi-storey apartment building near the Black Sea port of Odesa early on Friday, killing at least 14 people and injuring 30, Kyiv says.

Ukraine says another missile hit two buildings of a recreational centre in the region killing at least three people and injuring another.

https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2022/7/1/ukraine-russia-live-news-moscow-claims-its-forces-in-lysychansk-liveblog
 

Shall we just assume Russia was targeting a military (fill in the blank) and be done with it? How about a false flag attack, or maybe a Ukrainian anti aircraft missile blew up the building instead? Oh no, no wait. That’s right Putin said his missiles don’t miss and they don’t shoot at civilian buildings. It must have not have actually happen at all. 

what specifically you do not like in my version? why can there be a Russian missile, but not a Ukrainian anti-missile? why can't this be the result of the electronic warfare of the Armed Forces of Ukraine?

I mourn the dead Ukrainians.

But the last why - why don't you report the deaths of civilians on the other side with the same emotional intensity?

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11 hours ago, oldschooler said:

Lysychansk clearly about to fall. Russians already in suburbs. Don’t know how they crossed the river (so easily ? ). Ukraine not going to defend it like they did with their successful meat grinder Severodonetsk strategy.
 

Unfortunate sign of Ukrainian exhaustion & continuing lack of US heavy artillery ? Hoping Ukrainians can somehow Rally / Recover…..😔take high Russian toll…..

Same pro - Russians here Gloating ….again. Siding with the murderous Russian Savages …again. Zero Support for the brave defiant Victims…😠Despicable & Disgraceful. 😡

since this is a reply to my post, I have to answer too.  you are wrong.  I do not feel a sense of gloating, seeing the death of Ukrainians.  Ordinary Ukrainians do not deserve to die in the outskirts of Lysichansk for the interests of moneybags.

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35 minutes ago, KRLMRX said:

120x200=24,000 dead. I think you will not argue that official Kyiv, to put it mildly, downplays its losses. That is, we can say that the figure of 50,000 that Russia is talking about is quite realistic.

That’s not the way it works, that’s the estimated amount dying now. Not before or since day one. Did you notice where he said Russia losses are just as bad? Considering Ukraine has probably three times the number of troops in theater as Russia. The problem is bigger for Russia than a Ukraine one.
 

So the 50K number is your wild guess right?
 

He would certainly inflate the numbers when trying to get more support. That’s the way it works. 

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10 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

So you are saying Russia is not civilized then?

At last. We agree on something.

to be a civilized chauvinist or a humanist savage.  

This is your choice.  

I choose humanity and progress.

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16 minutes ago, KRLMRX said:

But the last why - why don't you report the deaths of civilians on the other side with the same emotional intensity?

Because Russia started the war, Russia keeps the war going, Russian is flinging inaccurate missiles into populated cities, and it’s Russia who chooses to not end the war. 
 

Oh and anti missile missiles have relatively small blast fragmentation war heads. When fired they self destruct if they don’t hit anything. Even if they were to land, the destruction would be much much smaller than the carrier killers Russia is using. 

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48 minutes ago, KRLMRX said:

The article is about combatants.  

yes, such losses speak of the incompetence of the Ukrainian military commanders.  

slightly larger than Russian ones.

Any Russian losses is down to Putin, I suggest you take that up with him. 

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7 hours ago, Marble-eye said:

Reeks of whataboutery to me. 🥴

Are you saying that the drawing of perfectly valid comparisons is disallowed, because you aren't able to put forward a rebuttal?

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13 minutes ago, EdwardV said:

That’s not the way it works, that’s the estimated amount dying now. Not before or since day one. Did you notice where he said Russia losses are just as bad? Considering Ukraine has probably three times the number of troops in theater as Russia. The problem is bigger for Russia than a Ukraine one.
 

So the 50K number is your wild guess right?
 

He would certainly inflate the numbers when trying to get more support. That’s the way it works. 

I wrote that this is reported by Russia, the official representative of the Russian Defense Ministry.  Explained why this might be.

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23 minutes ago, KRLMRX said:

Hoping Ukrainians can somehow Rally / Recover…..😔take high Russian toll…..

In your dreams. Russia is more powerful and will end up wrecking Ukraine bit by bit. Why is nobody calling for a ceasefire? It's a disgrace. 

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13 minutes ago, EdwardV said:

Because Russia started the war, Russia keeps the war going, Russian is flinging inaccurate missiles into populated cities, and it’s Russia who chooses to not end the war.

that is, you do not care about the death of civilians, because someone started a war.  received.

15 minutes ago, EdwardV said:

Oh and anti missile missiles have relatively small blast fragmentation war heads. When fired they self destruct if they don’t hit anything. Even if they were to land, the destruction would be much much smaller than the carrier killers Russia is using. 

what makes you think that the Ukrainian anti-missile must necessarily hit the Russian one and not deflect its course or fall nearby, for example?  Is there any evidence that Ukrainian military equipment is much more modern than Russian?

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9 minutes ago, KRLMRX said:

I wrote that this is reported by Russia, the official representative of the Russian Defense Ministry.  Explained why this might be.

No doubt 

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Faz said:

No doubt the apartment block was being used to house military personnel, with an underground repair facility for damaged armoured vehicles. The civilians were being used as shields. 🙄

How on earth are you able to say that when there are no independent journalists on the ground?

All news on this horrible war is coming from the Ukrainian government. Why on earth are major news sites, and this one, quoting a warring government as a single source of truth, with not a shred of journalism involved? Would we do the same in China or North Korea? Have our standards of reporting really slipped this far?

Edited by dbrenn
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5 minutes ago, dbrenn said:

Are you saying that the drawing of perfectly valid comparisons is disallowed, because you aren't able to put forward a rebuttal?

Coming from a man that ignores most questions asked of him that has to be the most rediculous and disingenuous reply ever recorded on this thread and judging by your past replies of other threads seems to be your modus operandi. 

How far back are you prepared to go to justify Putins murderous campagn, do you set the parameters of the off topic wars we discuss, for example would the Norman invasion of Britain still be on topic or does that war not fit into your warped and twisted agenda. 

Time you brought yourself into the real world and stop these pathetic excuses. You are embarrassing yourself whilst being a very disruptive force on here. 

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1 hour ago, KRLMRX said:

that is, you do not care about the death of civilians, because someone started a war.  received.

You are putting words in my mouth. I care about those attacked. That doesn't mean I don't care about any civilian deaths. One does not preclude the other. 

 

1 hour ago, KRLMRX said:

what makes you think that the Ukrainian anti-missile must necessarily hit the Russian one and not deflect its course or fall nearby, for example?  Is there any evidence that Ukrainian military equipment is much more modern than Russian?

What make you think it did? Anti aircraft missiles (the same ones shoot down missiles), have minimum launch range before their warhead arms itself. In addition, your typical intercept point is often miles away from the target. If you hit, yes it might not actually destroy the missile and instead just knock it down. However that impact area is usually much closer to the intercept point than the target. The chances of a missile getting intercepted and landing just a few yards away from the target (like the Mall attack) are next to zero. Not sure what that last sentence is eluding too. The S-300 missile is used by both countries and while not new, it's still quite effective. 

I have yet to hear the usual Russian excuse for the Odessa attack? Nothing? Just crickets? Maybe this time, they were actually shooting at civilians?  

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So many sheeples being led to the emotional slaughter house. 
100-200 Ukrainian soldiers are being killed every day and it is hardly mentioned because it hurts the war effort.
10 civilians die and it leads every Ukrainian press release  and Western headline because it helps the war effort.
95 out of 100 Russian missiles are hitting military targets and it is NOT mentioned because it hurts the war effort. 
1 missile hits a civilian building and it a global tragedy that you need to know about within the hour because it helps the war effort. 
For all we know the Ukrainians are lying through their teeth about reported civilian deaths. It wouldn’t be the first time. 20,000 civilians killed at Mariupol has been quietly revised down to 5,000 civilians. Russia bury the dead in individual plastic bags in mass graves and that is clear evidence that they are covering up a war crime. Ukraine bury the dead in individual plastic bags in mass graves and that is a matter of necessity.
God know how many civilians die a day and have so for years in Yemen but that is not even in the news. Maybe the victims aren’t white enough? Or maybe their social media presence just needs some work. Ukrainian citizens in the DPR & LPR are being shelled and dying daily but you don’t even know nor would probably care because they are representative of the enemy. Ukraine’s promotion of their civilian dead is unprecedented and the sheeples feeding at this trough of unintended death is also unprecedented.
btw: we discussed the most likely cause of missiles hitting civilian infrastructure yesterday - they are crap missiles. The idea of UAF electronic counter measures sending the missiles off target was ignored and brushed under the carpet because that leads to a conclusion that Ukraine are in a small way party to some of the civilian deaths and that is not a permitted option on the Kyiv script. Cue the outraged cries of condemnation for this post with obligatory slurs while we wait for the next inevitable civilian dead headline. Any distraction from the military situation in Ukraine’s east is a good thing for the Ukrainian war effort.

Baaaah baaaah…. 

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