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12 hours ago, Stonker said:

No they don't!

You keep on bleating about how Thais are "desperate" for tourists, but they're not.

Over the last couple of years Thais have protested in numbers about everything from school uniforms to gay marriage, lottery tickets to education, and about a lack of government support for those affected by restrictions, but there haven't been any protests about wanting tourists back or opening the borders.

NO protests, and not even any Thai led or organised complaints or petitions. NONE.

If you were here or you read the Thai media you'd know. But you're not, and you don't.

I agree 100%

 

But people say that, because they want to feel they themselves are important to Thailand 

 

As you say, life has been pretty normal for most Thais I know.

Some have been hurt a bit, but not disastrous by any means

 

My BIL's are in construction and contracting

They have been chock full of jobs for q long time 

 

All the people in my wife's area in Samut Prakan are getting on 

A lot WFH

 

Sure the tourism sector is hurt but that's one sector of the economy 

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21 hours ago, Jason said:

Even though I would qualify for test and Go, I only want to go to Phuket, so sandbox is less hassle. Oh and the government pays for the second test, even better.

its was 4200 baht for my prepaid 2 tests for the sandbox.  was not free for me

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18 hours ago, Stevejm said:

What you are really suggesting is that it would be better to quarantine all arrivals isn’t it? That’s what Malaysia is doing. 7 days in a hotel or at home on a tag for vaccinated residents and 10 days if not vaccinated. No tourists apart from Langkawi travel bubble. Or you could go the other way and follow the UK model and trust people to self isolate until test results come back

Yes - one or the other would be fine by me.  I have been 'campaigning' since early November when TAT advertising was saying Thailand is 'open again' and 'quarantine free' - totally fake.  Now they are doing it again - 'Test and Go Open Again' - small print about 2nd test and quarantine and face masks 24x7.  TATR and the Junta/Govt were lying to tourists and not being 'up front'.  Go to any social media feedback now and people are very negative, but back in November far too many people were 'Great - 2 years of Covid, but now I can have nice relaxing short holiday in Thailand'.  Wrong for many.

IMO it is not worth it for a short holiday, but some people have been coming for 2 or 3 week holidays, not realising the downsides of testing positive. Many arrivals were long term Expats and Business and Famnily returning, but too many naïve tourists were getting 'taken for a ride'. Plus very few people like me were saying early on 'wait a minute, the insurance does not cover asymptomatic hospitalisation or quarantining'. I can still remember having arguments with members here about that one - and several other issues - where are they now??

Open Up OR Quarantine/Sandbox - the Thai Junta Govt is trying to have it both ways and because of that it is a total farce as again and again they tried to adjust and change things - making it worse each time. 

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18 hours ago, Stevejm said:

It will be good when everyone has had it because it will then be endemic like the flu. The problem at the moment seems to be unvaccinated people who are using up hospital resources when they get really sick. I think it’s just a matter of being patient and suffering some silly inconvenient rules for a while. 

True - here in Aust over half of ICU and Deaths are unvaccinated. When the idiots claim this proves the vaccines dont work as half are vaccinated, I have to try and point out that almost 90% of Aussies are vaccinated - therefore the fact that 10% of the population are making up most of the ICUs and Deaths shows the vaccines work. They just dont get that - maths and logic not their strength. 

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18 hours ago, Stonker said:

No they don't!

You keep on bleating about how Thais are "desperate" for tourists, but they're not.

Over the last couple of years Thais have protested in numbers about everything from school uniforms to gay marriage, lottery tickets to education, and about a lack of government support for those affected by restrictions, but there haven't been any protests about wanting tourists back or opening the borders.

NO protests, and not even any Thai led or organised complaints or petitions. NONE.

If you were here or you read the Thai media you'd know. But you're not, and you don't.

Stonker - stop being aggressive abusive and contradictory or you and me will stop talking again mate.

My wife and I watch Thai news on many channels every single day. We live in a big house with 3 other Thais and we socially interact with local Thais a lot - and they all have family back in Thailand.  They and therefore I, are all very much across what is going on in Thailand.

Yes Thailand people do need tourism, it is the single greatest driver behind the 'real' workers economy and creates far more jobs and money circulation than anything else in the country.  In Phuket is is absolutely critical, but right across Thailand many millions of the 'lower' workers are struggling - not because there are fewer farming and manufacturing jobs, but because all the flow-ons from tourism (local and international) has basically stopped. Downstream issues from tourism in Thailand, is far more beneficial than building massives railways/projects, to ordinary Thais.

And lastly - the protests are all younger disgruntles complaining about the Junta and the Thai Laws that they want changed. Nothing whatsoever to do with tourism. Otherwise there would be demonstrations against the re-opening of tourism into the country. Not a related issue.

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18 hours ago, Stonker said:

But very few Thais do.

I live in a prime domestic tourist location - virtually no foreigners, 99%+ Thai.

It would be high season now normally, and usually I'd see at least a dozen buses an hour going past my house, every hour, 12 hours a day, November through to February.

This year so far there have been two - not two a day but two in total over a couple of months.

Some came back to see parents and children, but I don't think it's unreasonable to want to see your children and family a couple of times a year.

Even the government subsidies, paying 50% of the costs for hotels and tours, haven't been taken up.

Normally at New Year the traffic's so bad that it takes 20 hours to drive up here from Bangkok, but that never happened this year and it was taking the normal six.

I'm strongly against the stupidity of Songkran last year that sparked the current wave, but what you're saying simply isn't happening - that's not just 'my view' but you can see it from the take up of the subsidies.

Point missed completely.  The point is they are not tested - at all. 

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18 hours ago, Stonker said:

No they don't!

You keep on bleating about how Thais are "desperate" for tourists, but they're not.

Over the last couple of years Thais have protested in numbers about everything from school uniforms to gay marriage, lottery tickets to education, and about a lack of government support for those affected by restrictions, but there haven't been any protests about wanting tourists back or opening the borders.

NO protests, and not even any Thai led or organised complaints or petitions. NONE.

If you were here or you read the Thai media you'd know. But you're not, and you don't.

Imagine that. Correct on all points.

Thais are truly indifferent if foreigners are here or not - tourists or residents. And contrary to very Farang-centric thought, their world is centered around the presence of Western foreigners. They certainly wouldn't miss you or be terribly conscience ridden about not having you around. 

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7 hours ago, RJBT said:

What about my daughter who would like to come and visit

Now on day 5 she must return to a hotel. Will the local hotel in 304 Industrial do?

She has no intention of going to Bkk at all as I collect her at the airport

Crazy

I believe it will be any hotel that is accredited under the Test and Go program. Such hotels have to team up with a hospital for testing.It can be the same hotel that she stays in for the day one test. I think there are a number of hotels near the airport that can do it so no need to go into Bangkok. It might be better to delay the trip if possible until a more convenient entry scheme is implemented. The days if being free to travel internationally at will with minimum inconvenience aren’t back yet unfortunately.

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24 minutes ago, DesperateOldHand said:

Imagine that. Correct on all points.

Thais are truly indifferent if foreigners are here or not - tourists or residents. And contrary to very Farang-centric thought, their world is centered around the presence of Western foreigners. They certainly wouldn't miss you or be terribly conscience ridden about not having you around. 

I think there might be a few million people who work in the tourism related industries who are currently unemployed due to lack of business who might be glad to see the international tourists return en masse but they aren’t necessarily going to demonstrate to demand that border controls be dropped.

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10 minutes ago, Stevejm said:

 I believe it will be any hotel that is accredited under the Test and Go program. Such hotels have to team up with a hospital for testing.It can be the same hotel that she stays in for the day one test. I think there are a number of hotels near the airport that can do it so no need to go into Bangkok. It might be better to delay the trip if possible until a more convenient entry scheme is implemented. The days if being free to travel internationally at will with minimum inconvenience aren’t back yet unfortunately.

List - SHA Thailand  https://www.shathailand.com/list/

@RJBT  I agree with Steve that a delay is best if possible.  This new scheme is being criticised pillar to post (everywhere).  Likely that after it fails, the Junta/CCSA will try to open up the old scheme again - and 1 test is better than 2.   When that also fails, because it will be end of high season by then, they will finally drop the testing on arrival and let all in who are vaccinated, insured and tested negative via ATK/RAT prior to leaving.  Maybe a month for the old Test & Go?  Maybe a few months to drop all testing on arrival??  Who knows. 

I think that that last step (Vaccinated, Insured?, Negative RAT) will be adopted by most countries worldwide at some point, and it will become the 'new normal' for international travel going forward for a while.  Like when they scan you for banned items like scissors etc., I can also see them doing a 5 min RAT at the airport screening process.   PS - can any explain to me how someone can hijack a plane using nail clippers? 

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7 minutes ago, AussieBob said:

List - SHA Thailand  https://www.shathailand.com/list/

@RJBT  I agree with Steve that a delay is best if possible.  This new scheme is being criticised pillar to post (everywhere).  Likely that after it fails, the Junta/CCSA will try to open up the old scheme again - and 1 test is better than 2.   When that also fails, because it will be end of high season by then, they will finally drop the testing on arrival and let all in who are vaccinated, insured and tested negative via ATK/RAT prior to leaving.  Maybe a month for the old Test & Go?  Maybe a few months to drop all testing on arrival??  Who knows. 

I think that that last step (Vaccinated, Insured?, Negative RAT) will be adopted by most countries worldwide at some point, and it will become the 'new normal' for international travel going forward for a while.  Like when they scan you for banned items like scissors etc., I can also see them doing a 5 min RAT at the airport screening process.   PS - can any explain to me how someone can hijack a plane using nail clippers? 

I assume that you lost some clippers at security. I understand that all metal sharp objects are subject to confiscation. I suppose some idiot could break clippers in half and use the edges to harm someone

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19 minutes ago, Stevejm said:

Yes they talked about doing it over the New Year, but as far as I am aware that never actually happened. But I am certain it has not happened before that or since that period - family members travel now without tests in Thailand - train, plane or bus. 

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7 minutes ago, Stevejm said:

I assume that you lost some clippers at security. I understand that all metal sharp objects are subject to confiscation. I suppose some idiot could break clippers in half and use the edges to harm someone

Yeh - I guess that it their logic.  But the reality is that someone can do a lot more damage with a pen, that with a small nail clipper, but pens are OK.  Yep - one of 'those' things. 

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17 minutes ago, AussieBob said:

Yes they talked about doing it over the New Year, but as far as I am aware that never actually happened. But I am certain it has not happened before that or since that period - family members travel now without tests in Thailand - train, plane or bus. 

I think some airlines might have been asking for proof of vaccination for domestic flights but I am not 100% sure. I am pretty sure that temperature screening was carried out at airports. Everyone I know avoids buses and trains so I don’t know what measures were actually implemented 

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20 hours ago, Stonker said:

Wrong assumption.  What's wrong isn't the test on day 5 which makes a great deal of sense, but not quarantining people until then - that's what makes no sense at all.

I disagree. Firstly, no one has any reliable numbers of those who went undetected upon their arrival. Again, I suspect this number to be close to Zero, and you are not able to provide anything to prove me wrong. Sure enough tourists may infect themselves in TH and then have a positive test result, so from this point of view one could consider to have a general test regime for all tourists. But then, with a price tag of 2'100 THB per test, this would not incentivise any one to stay in TH for a longer period of time.

Last point: the whole idea of doing those tests is to prevent the "import" of the virus through tourists. I am 3x vaccinated, have had all tests showing negative, and yet you want to put me in quarantine? What sort of risk am I/are the other tourists? The virus is already onshore, so any 0-Covid plans are inachievable anyway. We tourists undergo a very rigid pre-entry and post-entry screening, so quarantine for someone fully vaccinated with several negative PCR-test is pointless. Switzerland with its distictively smaller population compared with Thailand, has actually a weekly rate of new infections of 3'379 people per 1 million. Thailand has currently 125 people per 1 million. Yet Switzerland decided yesterday that those fully vaccinated do not have to show a negative Covid test prior boarding a plane to Switzerland. Just need to fill in a digital entry form and show the QR-code at the border. This is how other countries do it; maybe the Thai authorities as well as yourself should reconsider your position?

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4 minutes ago, Fundok said:

I disagree. Firstly, no one has any reliable numbers of those who went undetected upon their arrival. Again, I suspect this number to be close to Zero, and you are not able to provide anything to prove me wrong. Sure enough tourists may infect themselves in TH and then have a positive test result, so from this point of view one could consider to have a general test regime for all tourists. But then, with a price tag of 2'100 THB per test, this would not incentivise any one to stay in TH for a longer period of time.

Last point: the whole idea of doing those tests is to prevent the "import" of the virus through tourists. I am 3x vaccinated, have had all tests showing negative, and yet you want to put me in quarantine? What sort of risk am I/are the other tourists? The virus is already onshore, so any 0-Covid plans are inachievable anyway. We tourists undergo a very rigid pre-entry and post-entry screening, so quarantine for someone fully vaccinated with several negative PCR-test is pointless. Switzerland with its distictively smaller population compared with Thailand, has actually a weekly rate of new infections of 3'379 people per 1 million. Thailand has currently 125 people per 1 million. Yet Switzerland decided yesterday that those fully vaccinated do not have to show a negative Covid test prior boarding a plane to Switzerland. Just need to fill in a digital entry form and show the QR-code at the border. This is how other countries do it; maybe the Thai authorities as well as yourself should reconsider your position?

I think Stonker's main point is correct 

 

I think if you took a poll of all Thai, the majority would be favor of these restrictions 

 

I personally don't know one Thai that isn’t in favor of strict restrictions 

 

So as people on a forum shout and scream at how stupid the Thai government is

 

I believe most of their citizens agree with them 

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21 hours ago, AussieBob said:

That is why I keep saying dont travel for a short holiday to Thailand right now. The odds of testing postive are growing and growing every day - which means 10-14 days of your short holiday being in a hotel, hospitel or hospital, plus friends, family and close contacts.  

That’s true especially for people coming from places like UK where basically all preventative measures have been dropped now despite having 100k positive tests per day. That last drink in the pub with all your unmasked friends the night before your flight could really end up ruining your holiday 

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On 1/21/2022 at 8:58 AM, Dmitrii said:

It sounds like they want to make some money on tourists who get infected when already being in Thailand.

Because a positive test on the day 5 or 6 likely means that the tourists have been infected with Omicron after their flight.

They just want to have this highly profitable business of taking money from mostly asymptomatic tourists basically for nothing.

All in all, it sounds like a trap, like a government level scam.

i said it before, it's a cash cow from the government to milk tourist insurance money.  Who really knows if these poor asymptomatic tourists are really positive?  Tourists are fully vaccinated (most with boosters, and test prior to departure, are at the mercy of the host country and their rules, they are trying to make up for loses from no tourism the past 1.5 years.  It's just another scam if you ask me.

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19 minutes ago, Fundok said:

I disagree. Firstly, no one has any reliable numbers of those who went undetected upon their arrival. Again, I suspect this number to be close to Zero, and you are not able to provide anything to prove me wrong. Sure enough tourists may infect themselves in TH and then have a positive test result, so from this point of view one could consider to have a general test regime for all tourists. But then, with a price tag of 2'100 THB per test, this would not incentivise any one to stay in TH for a longer period of time.

Last point: the whole idea of doing those tests is to prevent the "import" of the virus through tourists. I am 3x vaccinated, have had all tests showing negative, and yet you want to put me in quarantine? What sort of risk am I/are the other tourists? The virus is already onshore, so any 0-Covid plans are inachievable anyway. We tourists undergo a very rigid pre-entry and post-entry screening, so quarantine for someone fully vaccinated with several negative PCR-test is pointless. Switzerland with its distictively smaller population compared with Thailand, has actually a weekly rate of new infections of 3'379 people per 1 million. Thailand has currently 125 people per 1 million. Yet Switzerland decided yesterday that those fully vaccinated do not have to show a negative Covid test prior boarding a plane to Switzerland. Just need to fill in a digital entry form and show the QR-code at the border. This is how other countries do it; maybe the Thai authorities as well as yourself should reconsider your position?

I wouldn’t necessarily say that Switzerland has got it right and having 3 jabs is no guarantee that you can’t get infected. Testing might help prevent or slow the import of as yet unknown variants.The whole world will get it sorted hopefully soon but for the time being suffering inconvenience is a price we will have to pay if we insist on traveling internationally. 2100 Baht is a pretty cheap price for a pcr test

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9 minutes ago, gundam0315 said:

i said it before, it's a cash cow from the government to milk tourist insurance money.  Who really knows if these poor asymptomatic tourists are really positive?  Tourists are fully vaccinated (most with boosters, and test prior to departure, are at the mercy of the host country and their rules, they are trying to make up for loses from no tourism the past 1.5 years.  It's just another scam if you ask me.

How does the government make money from insurance?

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9 minutes ago, Marc26 said:

I think Stonker's main point is correct 

I think if you took a poll of all Thai, the majority would be favor of these restrictions 

I personally don't know one Thai that isn’t in favor of strict restrictions 

So as people on a forum shout and scream at how stupid the Thai government is

I believe most of their citizens agree with them 

I think you are correct - and that is why the Junta is continually trying to encourage tourists - while at the same time being very tough on them to 'protect the Thai people'. 

But that is not the point.  The point is that the rules are not going to attract that many tourists, because the risk of a positive test is very high (and getting higher), and the downsides are far too harsh.  

My extended Thai circle of family and friends in Thailand is generally against total relaxation. But that is because they were told by the Junta Govt that it was the foreigners that were bringing in the virus and spreading it around.  On one hand the Junta has been saying - come come Thailand open - but on the other hand they are saying -  foreigners are causing all the problems - but it is not us Thais or the unvaccinated 'illegals' coming over the borders from Laos, Myanmar, Malaysia and Cambodia for work and to visit families and for other reasons (drugs etc.).

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23 minutes ago, Stevejm said:

I think some airlines might have been asking for proof of vaccination for domestic flights but I am not 100% sure. I am pretty sure that temperature screening was carried out at airports. Everyone I know avoids buses and trains so I don’t know what measures were actually implemented 

I've recently used Thai Smile airlines and it was just a temperature check but nothing else much to my surprise.  I take the buses regularly in Bangkok and there are no checks of any kind apart from the obvious wearing of a face mask.  I can understand with bus travel but the airlines have the time to check each passenger before boarding if they wanted. 

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32 minutes ago, Stevejm said:

I think some airlines might have been asking for proof of vaccination for domestic flights but I am not 100% sure. I am pretty sure that temperature screening was carried out at airports. Everyone I know avoids buses and trains so I don’t know what measures were actually implemented 

I flew from BKK to Samui and also Samui to Utapao in December. I had to show proof of vaccination for both flights.

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